Episode 6
with Marjorie Saulson, communication confidence coach and founder of Vibrant Vocal Power · December 8, 2021 · 20 min
Communication confidence coach Marjorie Saulson defines public speaking as any time you talk to somebody other than yourself, including phone calls and networking events.
She says the basis of speaking confidence is confidence in your message, and that nerves are normal because fear and excitement are two sides of the same coin.
Marjorie advises practicing a talk out loud but memorizing only your opening and closing sentences.
Her ACED system for a question you can't answer is acknowledge, clarify, elicit, and deliver or delay.
Her free gift, 5 Speaking Landmines, is at vibrantvocalpower.com/kb.
Published · Updated
What is this episode about?
Public speaking confidence starts with believing in your message, says Marjorie Saulson, a communication confidence coach and the founder of Vibrant Vocal Power. Kathi Burns talks with Marjorie about why public speaking is any time you talk to somebody other than yourself, from a stage to a phone call to a room full of strangers. Marjorie explains how to treat pre-talk nerves as excitement, why she tells speakers to practice out loud but memorize only their first and last sentences, and her ACED system for answering a question when you don't know the answer. She also shares how to walk into a networking event and start with curiosity and a pain question instead of an elevator pitch, and why she believes each of us is obligated to share our gifts. Her free gift, 5 Speaking Landmines, is on her website.
When you can say that you don't know something, you actually build more trust than when you try and fake it.Marjorie Saulson
Jump to links and resources · Part of How do I become known as an expert? · All episodes · Every guest
What are the key takeaways?
- Marjorie Saulson defines public speaking as any time you talk to somebody other than yourself, which includes picking up the phone and talking to strangers at a networking event.
- She says confidence comes from knowing your message is worthwhile and that people need what you offer, not from faking it.
- Most people get nervous before they speak; Marjorie suggests reading those nerves as excitement and using that energy in your talk.
- Practice your talk out loud until it comes out naturally, but memorize only your opening and closing sentences so you don't sound like a robocall.
- When you can't answer a question, use ACED: acknowledge the question, clarify what is being asked, elicit ideas from others, then deliver an answer or delay and follow up.
- Saying you don't know something builds more trust than trying to fake an answer.
- At networking events, start by asking the other person about their work, then describe what you do with a pain question about the problem you solve.
This episode is brought to you by the Business Logjam Session
A private 75-minute online session with Kathi Burns to find the one thing holding your business back and leave with your next steps. It is the same F.L.O.W. process Kathi uses with her own clients: Focus on your goals, Locate your logjams, Outline your solutions, Walk away knowing your next steps.
Find What's Holding Me BackInterested in sponsoring the show? Get in touch.What counts as public speaking?
Marjorie Saulson counts any time you talk to somebody other than yourself as public speaking. She has worked with people who can address an audience of any size but freeze at the thought of calling someone or talking to strangers at a networking event. Kathi adds that her own brother led a company and did a lot of public speaking, yet he won't pick up the phone.
How do you build public speaking confidence?
Build public speaking confidence by trusting your message, treating nerves as excitement, and practicing out loud. Marjorie says confidence starts with knowing you have something worthwhile and that people need it. Most speakers get nervous, so don't beat yourself up. Practice while walking or driving until the words come out naturally.
Should you memorize your speech word for word?
No. Marjorie says a memorized talk makes you sound like a robocall, and if you lose your place you become a deer in the headlights. Her first speaking coach taught her to memorize only two things: the opening sentence, crafted to grab the audience's attention, and the closing sentence, which sends people off excited and ready to take the one action you ask of them. Kathi adds that she gives the same presentation many times but it is never the same, because she reads what the audience needs to hear.
What do you do when you don't know the answer to a question?
Use Marjorie's ACED system: acknowledge, clarify, elicit, then deliver or delay. Acknowledging the question buys time. Clarifying fixes vague questions, since you can't give a good answer to a bad question. Eliciting means asking others for their thoughts. Then you deliver an answer, or promise to research it and get back to them.
Is it OK to say "I don't know" at work?
Yes. Marjorie says our delicate egos hate to admit when we don't know something, but saying so builds more trust than faking an answer. One of her coaches says everybody's BS meter is always on in those moments. When people see you won't fake it, they know they can trust your word. Kathi calls it the biggest sign of professionalism.
How do you feel confident at a networking event?
Be curious about the other person before you talk about yourself. Marjorie suggests approaching someone standing alone and asking what they do, what drew them to it, and who they serve. When they ask about you, skip the memorized elevator pitch and open with a pain question about the problem you solve.
Why is it important to share your message?
Marjorie says each of us has a gift to share, and some people can only hear it in your voice. Her Jewish tradition teaches that we are partners in the repair of the world and obligated to do our piece of it, which we can only do by communicating. Kathi says speaking her plans out loud helped her clarify her own business, and Marjorie edits that advice to: don't tell, share.
What is Marjorie Saulson's free gift for speakers?
Marjorie's free gift is 5 Speaking Landmines and How to Avoid Them, at vibrantvocalpower.com/kb. The "kb" stands for Kathi Burns, so Marjorie knows Kathi sent you. She closes with a reminder for nervous speakers: you can't see anybody else's butterflies, but they can't see yours either.
Where does each part of the conversation start?
- 0:00 Meet Marjorie Saulson
- 1:40 What counts as public speaking
- 2:39 Your mess is your message
- 4:31 Handling nerves before you speak
- 6:53 Don't memorize your talk
- 7:30 Memorize your first and last lines
- 8:14 When you don't know the answer
- 8:39 The ACED system
- 11:00 Why "I don't know" builds trust
- 11:53 Getting your networking mojo back
- 12:30 Be curious, then ask a pain question
- 15:54 Why communicating matters
- 17:51 Don't tell, share
- 18:10 Free gift: 5 Speaking Landmines
- 19:25 You can't see their butterflies
What resources were mentioned?
- 5 Speaking Landmines and How to Avoid Them (Marjorie's free gift)
- ACED: acknowledge, clarify, elicit, deliver or delay (Marjorie's system for questions you can't answer)
- Stephen Covey's Seven Habits
These episodes continue the same thread as this one: Dr. Julie Marty-Pearson, Vince Warnock, Anne Bartolucci, Ally Machate also answer the question "How do I become known as an expert?", and the rest are the most recent conversations on the show.
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What did they say, word for word?
The transcript below is edited for readability: filler words and false starts are removed and speaker names are added. Nothing was added or summarized.
Read the full transcript +
Kathi: Hi, everyone, this is Kathi with Organized and Energized! We are back, and I'm very excited today because I'm speaking with Marjorie Saulson. She's been named both top speaking coach of the year and top motivational speaker of the decade. She's a communication confidence coach, and she's still going strong at 81. I wanted to interview Marjorie because public speaking is the number one item on most people's lists of what they fear. And I know that Marjorie is going to give us some golden tips that we can walk away with to be a better speaker with more confidence and more ease. So hi, Marjorie, how are you?
Marjorie: Yes.
Kathi: We all have to do it. So the question is, how do we do it best? And you are going to tell us that.
Marjorie: Well, first of all, I'd like to define what I call public speaking. Because when people think public speaking, they think giving a speech. And I define it as any time you talk to somebody other than yourself. I've actually worked with people who have no problem getting up in front of an audience of any size. Pick up the phone? You want me to pick up the phone and call somebody? Are you crazy? Go to a networking event and talk to all those strangers? I can't do that. It's any time you talk to somebody other than yourself. Think about it.
Kathi: Yeah. I have a brother. He just won't pick up the phone. But he's led a company and did a lot of public speaking. So isn't it funny how we have different ideas around what is public speaking and what's not? I think it's a really good point that you made. So tell me a little bit about yourself. How did you get into becoming the public speaking coach of coaches?
Marjorie: Well, it's very interesting. My first business coach, Pamela Bruner, said something I've never forgotten: your mess is your message. So, I can't do that, I'm a shy introvert? I say, I get it. I get it. Been there, done that. And the reality is that the only way you can build anything is to communicate. The cliche, Kathi, these days is that people want to do business with people they know, like and trust. That's a cliche because it's true. And how do you build that? By communicating. And if you don't communicate, you remain the best-kept secret. I truly believe each of us has a gift to share. And I will not accept this excuse: well, there are so many other people who do what I do, I don't need to do it. But there are some people who can only hear it in your voice. We've all looked for people to help us with something, and we pass on this one and pass on that one, and we finally find the one with whom we resonate. So each person needs to share his or her gifts. And how do you do that? You communicate them.
There are some people who can only hear it in your voice.
Kathi: I absolutely love that. And boy, it's been a theme that just keeps running through my podcast: everybody has their own gift. How are you going to express your gift, and what is the gift you have to express? And I agree, if you can't say it succinctly, it's a little bit more difficult to get people on your side, helping you with your business. So, a lot of people get really nervous before they speak. What are the two things that you advise people to do prior to speaking if the nerves have got them going? What should they do?
Marjorie: Okay, first of all, the basis of confidence is confidence in your message: knowing that you have something worthwhile to share, knowing that there are people out there who desperately need what you have to offer. If you're going to get up there and fake it till you make it, that is not a recipe for confidence. The other thing to remember is something that Mark Twain said. I love his quotes. Most people don't realize that he made his living in the latter part of his life giving speeches, because he lost all of his book money in some kind of boondoggle. And this is what he said: "There are two types of speakers, those who are nervous, and those who are liars." The reality is that most people get nervous before they speak. So number one, don't beat yourself up for it. Number two, you feel those nerves in your body. It's your brain that interprets them as fear. Fear and excitement are two sides of the exact same coin. Think of it as excitement: oh, I have this opportunity to share what my message is. And use that excitement to infuse your message with energy. We have all sat through talks by somebody who gets up there with absolutely no energy, or a low level. Let me out of here. When is this person ever going to finish? It's so boring. So use that energy, and understand that it is perfectly natural. And the more faith you have in your message, and the more you practice it ahead of time… By the way, which reminds me of an old joke. A guy goes up to a policeman in New York City and asks, how do you get to Carnegie Hall? And the policeman answers, practice, practice, practice.
Fear and excitement are two sides of the exact same coin.
Kathi: I love it.
Marjorie: If you want to feel confident in your message, number one, know that it's valuable. And number two, practice it when you're walking around the house, when you're driving. If you're driving someplace, say it out loud. Get it in your voice. And say it so many times that it just comes out.
Kathi: Yeah.
Marjorie: And don't try to memorize it exactly. You will sound like a robocall.
Kathi: It doesn't work anyhow. Before I go on stage, I always ask that whatever comes out of my mouth is what someone wants to hear, what someone needs to hear from me. So even though I'll do the same presentation over and over, it's never the same. And I think that's the whole ticket right there: know your message, but have the ability to feel the audience and know what they might need to hear, and then give it to them.
Marjorie: Yes. And I will share one other tip from my very first speaking coach. She was very much against memorizing things, because if you forget your place, then you're the deer in the headlights. But she said there are two things you should memorize: your opening sentence and your closing sentence. So you have the security of knowing exactly how you're going to start, and you carefully craft it to immediately get the audience's attention. And exactly how you're going to have this bravura finish that sends everybody off excited about what you shared and willing to take the single action that you ask them to take, whatever that is.
Kathi: I love that. Love, love, love. Okay, so this leads me to another question. You're at a networking event, or you get off stage, and someone asks you a question and you have no idea what the answer is. How do you handle something like that and come off with ease and confidence?
Marjorie: That's not my area of expertise. I must confess, I have no clue.
Kathi: There you go. There's your answer right there.
Marjorie: Yeah. Now, the other situation. I actually came up with a whole system, because there was a guy I worked with who was in corporate. And he told me he would sit through these corporate meetings in utter dread that he'd be asked a question he couldn't answer, and that would affect his possibility for a raise or advancement. So I came up with a system for that situation, and I call it ACED, like I aced the test. A: the minute I say it, you'll think, oh gosh, I've heard people do this a million times. Acknowledge. That's a very interesting question. That's a very good question. How many times have you heard that? You're buying time to hopefully get a gift from your subconscious: the answer. The C is for clarify, because the reality is you cannot give a good answer to a bad question. And some questions are so vague and so broad, how could you answer them without the Encyclopedia Britannica? So you say, I'm really not sure what specifically you're asking about. Could you give me an example of what you're asking about? And then the E is for elicit, E-L-I-C-I-T, meaning to draw forth. I-L-L-I-C-I-T means illegal. They're both pronounced the same. Draw forth: if you're in a group, or you're talking to somebody, have you given some thought to this question? Or, the answer isn't popping into my head right away; is there anybody else who could answer this question? And then the D is for deliver or delay. Deliver: you get this wonderful answer, your subconscious comes to your rescue, and you channel this wonderful answer and you give it. Or you delay. If it's something that you really are responsible for answering: let me get back to you. I need to research it, and I promise to get back to you with the answer. And then do it.
Kathi: Yeah, I think that's the biggest sign of professionalism, to say that you don't know, or say no.
Marjorie: I have to tell you, our delicate egos hate to admit when we don't know something. But the reality is, and it's counterintuitive, that when you can say that you don't know something, you actually build more trust than when you try and fake it.
When you can say that you don't know something, you actually build more trust than when you try and fake it.
Kathi: Yeah, people know when you're faking it. They know, even if you think you pulled it off beautifully.
Marjorie: One of my coaches says everybody's BS meter is always on in those kinds of situations. The reality is that you do actually build more trust, because people know that when you answer a question, it is the truth and the answer as you know it, and you're not trying to fake it. So they know they can trust your word. And that's a whole other ballgame.
Kathi: Yes, truly. So someone's at a networking event. Now we're getting ready to maybe go back into networking, so I think this is a timely topic, whether we choose to or we stay on Zoom. But should you choose to go into a networking situation, into a full room, and you are not confident at all, do you have any tips to help people navigate that? And hey, a lot of us are not used to being in person anyhow. So even if we were good at networking before, maybe we've lost our mojo. What are the tips, as you're walking into an event, to get your mojo back and feel confident in networking?
Marjorie: First of all, we all hate it when somebody comes up and starts talking at us about their wonderful business or opportunity. No way. Be curious. Go up to somebody who's standing by themselves feeling really uncomfortable, and say hi, and introduce yourself, and say, it's nice. Have you been at this event before? Isn't it nice to be back again? So what do you do? And ask that person, what attracted you to that? What do you like about doing that? Ask the other person, what kind of people do you serve? Maybe I know somebody who might be able to use your services. It's one of Stephen Covey's Seven Habits: first seek to understand, then to be understood. That is a very, very good way to start. And you are making the other person feel comfortable. So now, when they ask you what you do, you do not go into your robocall memorized elevator pitch. Please don't do that. I like to start out with what I call a pain question. Do you know how sometimes you might miss opportunities because you're not sure what to say, or how to say it, or you're afraid to say it? That's the pain people have that I help them with: figuring out what to say, how to say it without boring people to death, engaging their attention, and getting over the fear of saying it. So figure out a pain question about a problem that you solve. And if you don't want to be so direct, everybody's had the experience; there's nobody who hasn't kept themselves quiet when they should have spoken. Look at what you do. What's the pain you solve? You help people. Ever feel like your whole office, your whole life, is disorganized and you can't find something, and where in the heck did I leave my whatever? You've got it: the problem you solve, everybody has.
Kathi: Yeah, I'm blessed like that. I love that, because I love public speaking, I love podcasting, I love working one on one with my clients, but whenever I get into a group, or I'm just standing in the grocery line, I'm shy again. And I'll definitely use the be curious, be open. I have friends whose best friends are the ones they met in the grocery line. It's like, seriously? How do you know all those people? So the curiosity thing is a wonderful, wonderful tip. I'm going to walk away using it for sure, Marjorie. And the ACED thing is great. We'll put the ACED thing down below, because that'll be a nice little reminder for me.
Marjorie: It's acknowledge, clarify, elicit with an E, and deliver or delay.
Kathi: Love it. So as we wind down, gosh, you just have so much, I could talk to you forever. But what's the one thing that you think I should have asked you about what you do that I did not?
Marjorie: Why it's so important for people to communicate.
Kathi: Okay, why is it so important that people should speak?
Marjorie: Well, this is actually part of my mission. My tradition, which is the Jewish tradition, teaches that we are God's partners in the repair of the world. We're not obligated to do the whole world, but we are obligated to do our piece of it. And the only way we can do our piece of it is when we can communicate and help those people whom we are really obligated to serve and help.
Kathi: I love that. And if you don't say what you do, or you don't express who you are, people can't call upon you for what you might be able to offer.
Marjorie: Yes, and there are people out there who desperately need what each of us has to offer.
Kathi: Isn't that the beauty of it? That's the beauty of life: we all have our own gifts. And gee, this is so timely, Marjorie. Everybody's doing the mass exodus, and they're trying to find their way, and they want to become entrepreneurs. That's what this podcast is all about, giving tips to those people. But if you can communicate what your gift is, and start telling everybody what your gift is, you'll end up having rallying support around you. I remember when I came home and said to my husband, hey, I'm going to be a professional organizer and an image consultant. I put it out there. I spoke the words, and he's like, what's that? But it allowed me to clarify what it really was and what it meant to me and what I was meant to do. So speak your message, speak your truth, speak. I think the biggest thing is, what's your biggest desire? What do you really love to do? Because I think what you love to do is probably what other people will need from you.
Marjorie: And I would make one edit. Don't tell, share.
Don't tell, share.
Kathi: Ah, thank you. Yes, yes, yes. Share your message. Share your idea. Okay, thank you. See, I need an editor like you in my life.
Marjorie: That's one of my gifts. I am actually a former magazine editor. And I do have a gift for everybody.
Kathi: Yes, let's hear about it.
Marjorie: Okay, it is called Five Speaking Landmines and How to Avoid Them. Did you want to share the link in the chat?
Kathi: The link is going to be down below on the podcast page itself, so you'll be able to get to it easy-breezy. It'll be on the page, as well as a few snippets and giveaways of things that we've said that I think are good, like the ACED thing.
Marjorie: Yeah. And it's vibrantvocalpower.com, which is my website, forward slash KB, as in Kathi Burns. So when you go to get that gift, I will know, oh, Kathi sent this person. Thank you, Kathi.
Kathi: You're so welcome, Marjorie. I really appreciate your time being on the podcast and giving the golden nuggets. And anybody who has a fear of speaking, please, please go to Marjorie. She's the pro in the business, and she can help you on your way, even if it's just how to walk into a networking group.
Marjorie: Absolutely. Absolutely. Just remember, you can't see anybody else's butterflies, but they can't see yours either.
Kathi: True that. Thank you, Marjorie. Have a fabulous holiday season.
Marjorie: Thank you, same to you. I really appreciate the invitation.
Where can I find the links and resources from this episode?
Connect with Marjorie
Organizations and companies
Books and resources
Inspired? Here Are Your Action Steps:
- Write down why your message is worthwhile and who needs it before your next talk.
- When nerves hit, tell yourself it's excitement and put that energy into your delivery.
- Practice your talk out loud while walking around the house or driving.
- Memorize only your opening sentence and your closing sentence.
- End every talk by asking the audience to take one single action.
- When you get a question you can't answer, acknowledge, clarify, elicit, then deliver or delay.
- If you promise to get back to someone with an answer, do it.
- At your next networking event, ask someone standing alone what they do and who they serve.
- Replace your elevator pitch with a pain question about the problem you solve.
- Download Marjorie's 5 Speaking Landmines at vibrantvocalpower.com/kb.
Frequently asked questions
How can I increase my confidence when public speaking?
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Marjorie Saulson says confidence starts with confidence in your message: knowing you have something worthwhile and that people need it. She recommends practicing the talk out loud, while walking around the house or driving, until it comes out naturally. Memorize only your opening and closing sentences.
How do I get over my fear of public speaking?
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Marjorie points out that most people get nervous before they speak, so don't beat yourself up for it. She says your brain interprets those nerves as fear, but fear and excitement are two sides of the same coin. Treat it as excitement and use that energy to bring your message to life.
What to do when you don't know the answer to a question?
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Marjorie teaches the ACED system: acknowledge the question, clarify what is being asked, elicit ideas from the person or the group, then deliver an answer or delay. If you delay, promise to research it and get back to them, and then do it.
How do I politely say I don't know the answer?
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Be direct and offer to follow up: let me get back to you, I need to research it. Marjorie says admitting you don't know builds more trust than trying to fake it, because people learn they can rely on your word.
How do you start a conversation at a networking event?
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Marjorie suggests going up to someone standing alone, introducing yourself and asking about them: what they do, what attracted them to it and who they serve. She calls it first seeking to understand, then to be understood. When they ask about you, open with a question about the problem you solve instead of an elevator pitch.
Who is talking in this episode?
About the Host, Kathi Burns
Kathi Burns, CPO®, is a Business FLOW Strategist based in San Diego. For the last 20+ years, Kathi has helped clients create systems they can stick to. She is the author of How to Master Your Muck, Organizing With Tetris and Home Organization, The Smart Guide, and co-author of four more titles; all are in Kathi's shop. Kathi's business has been featured on Good Morning America, and her advice has been featured in Oprah Magazine, Martha Stewart Living, Better Homes and Gardens and Entrepreneur Magazine.
More about Kathi · Shop Kathi's books · Business Logjam Session · Apply to be a guest
About Marjorie Saulson
Marjorie Saulson is a communication confidence coach and the founder of Vibrant Vocal Power. Kathi Burns introduces her in the episode as having been named both top speaking coach of the year and top motivational speaker of the decade. Marjorie describes herself as a recovering shy introvert, and she is a former magazine editor. She defines public speaking as any time you talk to somebody other than yourself, so she helps people speak with confidence on stage, on the phone, in meetings and at networking events, with a focus on helping women find their voices. She offers private coaching, online training and speaking, and she is the niece of three suffragettes who campaigned for women's right to vote.
Want help putting this into practice?
Book a Business Logjam Session with Kathi
A private 75-minute online session to find the one thing holding your business back and leave with your next steps, using the same F.L.O.W. process Kathi uses with her own clients: Focus on your goals, Locate your logjams, Outline your solutions, Walk away knowing your next steps.
Prefer to start small? Download Kathi's free eBook 6 Steps to Organize Your Home Office.
Published · Updated
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